plotting attacks in the west including in the united states. we know that a range of individuals like richard park had alarm bells ringing at the white house level, but, again, at that point, when we go back and look, the administration at that point was focused on things like the balcans and fires elsewhere. >> host: in the national security arena. now, you talk about this wave of al-qaeda violence, and then they get beaten back. sometimes, because of their own actions, what caused the kind of temporary defeat the first time? was it our launch on afghanistan? >> guest: well, actually, it's about the reverse of the coin we just outlined. they lost the sanctuary in afghanistan so the host they had, the taliban regime, was overthrown, and in addition to that, we saw a u.s. approach that was focused mostly on services, the cia, the range of other intelligence services, nsa, geospatial, and then in special operational forces targeting in afghanistan and then in pakistan and other locations. >> host: you're talking about in 2001, how the u.s. fought back by sending in cia and special force